It's not just the internet they're tracking

[DPancoast]

It might be phonecalls too.

Report: NSA tracking all U.S. phone calls
By UPI Staff
United Press International
May 11, 2006

WASHINGTON (UPI) -- Three major U.S. telephone companies are providing the National Security Agency with records of every phone call made, USA Today reported Thursday.

Sources who asked not to be identified told the newspaper AT&T, Verizon and BellSouth are contributing to a massive database of the calls, which will be used to analyze calling patterns to detect terrorist activity.

The three telecommunications companies are working under contract with the NSA, which launched the program in 2001 shortly after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, sources said.

Customers' names, street addresses and other personal information are not being handed over as part of NSA's domestic program, the sources said. But the phone numbers the NSA collects can easily be cross-checked with other databases to obtain that information.

Among the telecommunications companies, sources said only Qwest has refused to help the NSA because it was uneasy about the legal implications of handing over customer information to the government without warrants.

Copyright 2006 United Press International, Inc. All Rights Reserved

[ftblplyr46]

I understand how everyone gets their panties in a bunch about our constitutional rights, but if your not doing nothing illegal, I don't see the problem. I don't mind, its not bothering me, and it could actually help me. Just gotta know where to draw the line.

[phillyboy]

you'd be surprised how quickly "nothing illegal" turns into illegal if they want it to. do you think everyone who's ever been arrested or convicted of a crime has been guilty? there's this poem or saying or whatever that i always think about, it was written by this pastor.
First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.

basically the message is stand up for what's wrong because it's wrong. not because it affects you.

[Snow Wolf]

Maybe you`ll understand when have no rights left.........

[badattitude]

dont you get that we need to wipe these here phukers out? You liberals whining bout the stoopid constitution......let bush have the tools to protect us I say!!!!

[phillyboy]

I'm conservative. But thanks for playing.

[Snow Wolf]

See.....a Commie and Conservative can get along...... :)

If all conservatives were as educated and rational as you, I would`nt have a problem with them.....unfortunately too many are like that freak!

[phillyboy]

Did you ever think it was odd that Communism is anti-God, however Christianity is pro-Communism? (not westernized neo-Christianity, but real Christianity) Just something I always found interesting.

[Snow Wolf]

Well, as an ecconomic system, true Communism does not neccessarily take an anti-God position. Joseph Stalin seems to have really put a lot of his own predjudices in the mix. Your right about the other thing and that really goes along with Christs teaching.....loving thy neighbor, caring for the sick, old and less fortunate, etc....by definition, Christ would have been at the very least, a liberal and likely a Socialist or Communist........probably get flamed for this.....I don`t mean it in an offensive way :)

[phillyboy]

Not only that but early Christians specifically lived by selling their property and donating the proceeds to the community, which was divided and dispersed to each according to their needs. However, this was I believe an attempt to just live simply without becoming attached to worldly possessions, for your treasure is in Heaven. Socialism does it to keep itself state-centered. So, same means, different ends.
And it wasn't necessarily Stalin that emphasized opposition to religion. Marx's famous quote about religion being an opiate of the people is the common reference to Communism/socialism's stance on religion.
But there is definite bias in quotes like this. It is impossible to be a true Christian (or most other religions) and fall in line with any government. You can see it in writings and political movements to move away from religion, because it takes away from the power and infallibility of governments. Separation of Church and State was an attempt to keep the government on top while letting everyone practice their religion. And there are Christians who believe they are true Christians but still give allegiance to their country. I don't believe this is possible. True Christianity is the biggest f you to the state. Just read Matthew and Acts. you get a very anti-establishment feel from them.

[IceCoastChick]

you'd be surprised how quickly "nothing illegal" turns into illegal if they want it to. do you think everyone who's ever been arrested or convicted of a crime has been guilty? there's this poem or saying or whatever that i always think about, it was written by this pastor.
First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.

basically the message is stand up for what's wrong because it's wrong. not because it affects you.

I remember that poem. It was written about the Nazi's taking over and how everyone was a bystander to what they were doing and never took action. Being a bystander is just as bad as the person wronging everybody.

[phillyboy]

I remember that poem. It was written about the Nazi's taking over and how everyone was a bystander to what they were doing and never took action. Being a bystander is just as bad as the person wronging everybody.
Apathy is a blight on humanity. It's the reason bad things happen: because it's allowed to happen.

[Snow Wolf]

Not only that but early Christians specifically lived by selling their property and donating the proceeds to the community, which was divided and dispersed to each according to their needs. However, this was I believe an attempt to just live simply without becoming attached to worldly possessions, for your treasure is in Heaven. Socialism does it to keep itself state-centered. So, same means, different ends.

And it wasn't necessarily Stalin that emphasized opposition to religion. Marx's famous quote about religion being an opiate of the people is the common reference to Communism/socialism's stance on religion.

But there is definite bias in quotes like this. It is impossible to be a true Christian (or most other religions) and fall in line with any government. You can see it in writings and political movements to move away from religion, because it takes away from the power and infallibility of governments. Separation of Church and State was an attempt to keep the government on top while letting everyone practice their religion. And there are Christians who believe they are true Christians but still give allegiance to their country. I don't believe this is possible. True Christianity is the biggest f you to the state. Just read Matthew and Acts. you get a very anti-establishment feel from them.






This is, again, another area that I have a real problem with the administration and the fundamentalist Christian right who have supported it. Separation of church and state has worked very well for America since she became a nation; both for the religious and for the non believers as well as the state itself. Religion has thrived because of that separation, not in spite of it. I think it is a very wrong and dangerous path we are beginning to head down right now, toward Theocracy. I see how a Christian theocratic state could easily become a mirror reflection of life under the Taliban. Also, how do so many good and decent Christians turn a blind eye to what could be siad to be a war or rather wars that have at the very least..."questionable" motives that have resulted in so much widespread death, destruction and misery on all sides? You know my position on the war and on Bush; but, without trying to be hyper-critical, I honestly do not understand how they reconcile this with their moralaity. This administration`s seeming obsession with power and wealth to me, is contrary to Christ`s teachings. Their policies favor the rich and powerfull and are beginning to devastate the middle class and the poor.
Yes, Marx himself was an atheist, but in the Manifesto, nothing written prohibits freedom of religion; it really is designed as a socio-ecconomic system. it is my belief that Communism could only ever have a chance of working in a democracy, which is one of the reasons it has failed so miserably where it has been tried. In Czarist Russia, the same Oligarchs that oppressed the populace, found positions of power within the Communist party and bastardized it to continue to oppress the populace. Lenin tried to stick with the true principles of Marxism and Leon Trotsky was even more on the mark and both got aced by the self centered people following Stalin. Joseph Stalin betrayed Communism and Mother Russia much the way I see certain members of neocon movement betraying conservatism, the Republican party and the nation. I used to be a registered Republican, but the party has drifted too far to the radical right for me to support anymore and under Bush it has`nt drifted, it has violently careened into the ditch. I support the ideals of Communism as a socio-ecconomic system that could work under our representative constitutional republic. We would have to end all forms of lobbying for starters so that our politicians are directly answerable to the people only. I do not forsee a total end to Capitalism; it just needs to be heavily regulated to stop huge predatory corporations from doing harm to the overall society. In fact, the small businesses would be able to flourish without the unfair competition that huge corporations pose. Energy, transportation and infrastucture should be state controlled to serve the society, not to generate obscene profits for a handfull of Olligarchs. I see no contradiction between Communism and our Constitution or our Republic. Communism or Socialism in America would be a totally unique entity just as America herself has been a unique entity in world history. Lastly, please understand that in all my rantings and goings on about how I hate this administration and all, I do not hate America, I just see America at a crossroads where she has a choice to evolve into something even greater, or regress back into something that will always be a shadow of her former glory. As a Communist, I want the same thing for America as everyone else, I just believe there is a better way to achieve it than the track we are on.

[username? tim?]

commie lol